EP 15: "Touring Scotland" with Owen Innes from the Scottish History Podcast

[00:00:00] [SPEAKER_01]: This is 63 Percent Scottish, a Scotland Appreciation Podcast

[00:00:07] [SPEAKER_00]: Welcome to 63 Percent Scottish. My name is Eamon OFlynn and I'm your host. If you're a tourist and you want to see Scotland

[00:00:13] [SPEAKER_00]: There are a few ways to do it. Those with the confidence to drive on the wrong side of the road might rent a car

[00:00:18] [SPEAKER_00]: But good luck in taking in the sights when you're navigating bend after bend. They don't do straight roads in the Highlands

[00:00:25] [SPEAKER_00]: You can take a train

[00:00:27] [SPEAKER_00]: It's great great for scanning the scenery, but your destination options might be a bit limited

[00:00:31] [SPEAKER_00]: I also suspect many North Americans might be wary of relying too heavily on public transport

[00:00:36] [SPEAKER_00]: The other option is joining a tour group. The benefits are pretty obvious

[00:00:40] [SPEAKER_00]: You don't have to drive you can take in the scenery

[00:00:43] [SPEAKER_00]: You have a guide who knows where they're going and can point out interesting details and landmarks

[00:00:48] [SPEAKER_00]: And since it's a service that's designed for tourists. I bet they usually go to places tourists want to go

[00:00:55] [SPEAKER_00]: These tours are readily available in Scotland, but when I was thinking about it about them it occurred to me

[00:01:00] [SPEAKER_00]: I don't think that sort of thing is nearly as popular in Canada

[00:01:04] [SPEAKER_00]: Sure, there are tours within cities and if you're in Toronto

[00:01:07] [SPEAKER_00]: There's probably a bus to go to Niagara Falls, but I just don't think we have the same tourism culture

[00:01:12] [SPEAKER_00]: It's probably because we have fewer castles and less history in general

[00:01:18] [SPEAKER_00]: We also don't have the Isle of Skye

[00:01:20] [SPEAKER_00]: Which I think is a is a big big draw

[00:01:23] [SPEAKER_00]: It made me wonder what kind of person becomes a tour guide

[00:01:27] [SPEAKER_00]: How do you get into it? How do you learn to drive the big bus?

[00:01:31] [SPEAKER_00]: What kinds of crazy things must you see in that career?

[00:01:34] [SPEAKER_00]: And then I realized that friend of the podcast Owen Ennis

[00:01:38] [SPEAKER_00]: Might be able to answer some of these questions in addition to being the host of a top Scottish history podcast

[00:01:43] [SPEAKER_00]: The Scottish history podcast. He's a tour guide who's been doing the job for years

[00:01:48] [SPEAKER_00]: In fact, I'm pretty sure he said he got into podcasting because he was a tour guide with all kinds of stories and historical facts floating around in his head

[00:01:57] [SPEAKER_00]: Let's see what he has to say. Welcome back to the show Owen

[00:02:01] [SPEAKER_00]: Thank you. Looking around at me. I had pleasure

[00:02:04] [SPEAKER_00]: Absolutely pleasure. I think that tourism in Scotland is at just a different level entirely

[00:02:10] [SPEAKER_00]: And I did look up

[00:02:12] [SPEAKER_00]: I decided to look up the percentage of the GDP of Canada in Scotland that is is generated by tourism with us

[00:02:19] [SPEAKER_00]: You don't okay, so Scotland is about 5%

[00:02:23] [SPEAKER_00]: Canada it's 1.7%

[00:02:27] [SPEAKER_00]: It's I mean that kind of reflects what I was what I was thinking

[00:02:30] [SPEAKER_00]: I think it's a real in like a really big industry, right? I mean you think oh, yeah

[00:02:35] [SPEAKER_00]: Edinburgh for instance, you can't go anywhere

[00:02:39] [SPEAKER_01]: Without something being very touristy to be honest even even if there were no tourists in Edinburgh

[00:02:44] [SPEAKER_01]: You wouldn't even hear like proper Edinburgh accents anyway

[00:02:47] [SPEAKER_01]: So many students life from all around the world. So it's great

[00:02:51] [SPEAKER_01]: Like when you actually here a Scottish accent in Edinburgh, you kind of do a double take you're like wait your local

[00:02:57] [SPEAKER_01]: You're actually from here. It's really cool though. Yeah

[00:03:07] [SPEAKER_00]: I'm

[00:03:08] [SPEAKER_00]: Move here to be to do tours

[00:03:12] [SPEAKER_01]: We do have a lot of it. I think I'm sure I'm sure

[00:03:17] [SPEAKER_01]: Ravi's the company that I worked for

[00:03:19] [SPEAKER_01]: I'm sure they have

[00:03:21] [SPEAKER_01]: Sure couple my colleagues are from Canada

[00:03:25] [SPEAKER_01]: I

[00:03:25] [SPEAKER_01]: Definitely know there's something that works for a company I used to work for that's that's from Canada as well

[00:03:29] [SPEAKER_01]: So like they've come over here to work in the tourism industry

[00:03:32] [SPEAKER_01]: Enjoyed like working with the people so much that they then decided to become guides themselves, which is really cool

[00:03:38] [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, and and also they're intelligible for for North Americans

[00:03:44] [SPEAKER_00]: Exactly no

[00:03:48] [SPEAKER_00]: No interpretation

[00:03:50] [SPEAKER_01]: I'm getting good now at telling the accents. I'm getting good at just like listening to people. I'm going you're from Canada

[00:03:57] [SPEAKER_01]: You're not from the United States. So this is

[00:04:01] [SPEAKER_00]: I always find this kind of thing interesting because

[00:04:04] [SPEAKER_00]: You know, I hear a bit of difference between Canadian accents and obviously I hear a very big difference between Scottish accents

[00:04:11] [SPEAKER_00]: But I get this all the time that I'm a lot of people think I'm American because I grew up so close to the border

[00:04:18] [SPEAKER_00]: Like a lot of Canadian luck names are very close

[00:04:20] [SPEAKER_00]: but I'm very very close to the border and so people confuse me for someone from Michigan all

[00:04:26] [SPEAKER_00]: The time but if I go to Michigan, they immediately know I'm not

[00:04:32] [SPEAKER_00]: Like are you Canadian?

[00:04:34] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I think I think you kind of it away find that

[00:04:38] [SPEAKER_01]: Just even like Northumberland

[00:04:41] [SPEAKER_01]: like in the north of England, it's like

[00:04:44] [SPEAKER_01]: There's there's a time called Berwick Berwick upon tweet. So there's two barracks

[00:04:48] [SPEAKER_01]: There's North Berwick in Scotland and then Berwick upon tweet. It's literally just over the border

[00:04:52] [SPEAKER_01]: They're football team plays in the Scottish leagues, but it's in England. Okay

[00:04:57] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah

[00:04:58] [SPEAKER_01]: But like everyone in Berwick has a Scottish accent

[00:05:02] [SPEAKER_01]: and then when you go down into like Northumberland and even

[00:05:05] [SPEAKER_01]: Like even say maybe even down as far as Newcastle

[00:05:08] [SPEAKER_01]: The accents are quite similar like you can obviously tell someone from Newcastle

[00:05:13] [SPEAKER_01]: Like there's they've got a completely different sort of accent

[00:05:16] [SPEAKER_01]: But like just the the things that we say like even just the word I

[00:05:20] [SPEAKER_01]: Like for saying yes is that kind of seems to travel down that that sort of that northeast coast of

[00:05:29] [SPEAKER_01]: England and from the southeast coast of Scotland

[00:05:31] [SPEAKER_01]: Which I've always found quite interesting like I'm getting more interested in languages and like and sort of listening and working out the

[00:05:39] [SPEAKER_01]: The similarities and stuff

[00:05:42] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah over the last kind of couple of years

[00:05:44] [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, so okay. Well, let's get into this

[00:05:47] [SPEAKER_00]: What what made you want to become a tour guide? What kind of person becomes a tour guide?

[00:05:54] [SPEAKER_01]: so like so I started and

[00:05:57] [SPEAKER_01]: It would be 10 years this year

[00:05:59] [SPEAKER_01]: Since I started driving buses

[00:06:03] [SPEAKER_01]: So I worked for the big sort of public service bus company in Edinburgh

[00:06:09] [SPEAKER_01]: low-deand buses and I

[00:06:12] [SPEAKER_01]: Just I've always enjoyed driving. I've been like effectively

[00:06:16] [SPEAKER_01]: Driving professionally for now about 13 years 12 or 13 years. I was chauffeuring beforehand

[00:06:25] [SPEAKER_01]: Suiting tie the whole job, you know

[00:06:27] [SPEAKER_01]: And then and then I applied for this this bus company thinking this is gonna be the greatest thing ever

[00:06:32] [SPEAKER_01]: I'm gonna join this bus company and I'm just gonna drive double-decker buses around

[00:06:36] [SPEAKER_01]: I'm gonna be the happiest person on earth and then after a year. You're like I'm just locked in a box

[00:06:43] [SPEAKER_01]: driving a

[00:06:45] [SPEAKER_01]: Big machine no one wants to talk to you

[00:06:50] [SPEAKER_01]: And when people do want to talk to you because no one's talked to you for like four hours by that particular point

[00:06:56] [SPEAKER_01]: You're just like

[00:06:58] [SPEAKER_01]: You know, your your your only response is just a grunt at people so they think that you're miserable

[00:07:04] [SPEAKER_01]: So and realistically I was utterly miserable doing it

[00:07:08] [SPEAKER_01]: So I think I

[00:07:11] [SPEAKER_01]: Think it was just that there's like the

[00:07:15] [SPEAKER_01]: Indeed indeed.com or whatever like a job hunting sort of website. I

[00:07:21] [SPEAKER_01]: Think it was the first time I'd ever actually been on that website just like right. Okay. I have a

[00:07:26] [SPEAKER_01]: PCV passenger carrying vehicle license. What other jobs can I do?

[00:07:31] [SPEAKER_01]: This like this and then the first one that came up was do you like people? I was like sometimes

[00:07:38] [SPEAKER_01]: Do you like history? I was like, yeah, do you like Scotland? Yes. And can you drive a bus?

[00:07:46] [SPEAKER_01]: I was like well three out of four ain't bad, you know

[00:07:48] [SPEAKER_01]: so

[00:07:50] [SPEAKER_01]: This is all my tour guy power by the way

[00:07:52] [SPEAKER_01]: Anyone who's ever if there's anyone listening this has been on my tour with me

[00:07:55] [SPEAKER_01]: They've heard this before and but if anyone ends up wanting to this is exactly the same stuff

[00:07:59] [SPEAKER_01]: I see

[00:08:01] [SPEAKER_01]: But I so I applied and started doing it

[00:08:07] [SPEAKER_01]: And and I loved it and just and have done ever since I loved learning I

[00:08:13] [SPEAKER_01]: Love learning and then not necessarily teaching. I think sometimes it can almost feel like you're teaching people

[00:08:21] [SPEAKER_01]: If I wanted to become a teacher then I would have stuck to what I originally wanted to do which was music

[00:08:28] [SPEAKER_01]: Because that's pretty much the only job you can get if you get a music degree

[00:08:33] [SPEAKER_01]: Especially when you can't read music that's a bit difficult

[00:08:37] [SPEAKER_01]: so

[00:08:37] [SPEAKER_01]: So, yes, I just I loved learning my dad and I'll always I'll always say this every every podcast

[00:08:45] [SPEAKER_01]: I've ever been on and my dad was a huge influence as well in

[00:08:50] [SPEAKER_01]: My formative years as a child would take us to the castles and tells all the history

[00:08:54] [SPEAKER_01]: Like I remember watching Braveheart Braveheart came out when I was five. No, sorry came at 95

[00:09:00] [SPEAKER_01]: So I was eight

[00:09:02] [SPEAKER_01]: eight years old

[00:09:04] [SPEAKER_01]: He rented it when it came out in VHS

[00:09:08] [SPEAKER_01]: We watched it and we watched it right the way through my dad said what a load of guff. What's a load of absolute nonsense

[00:09:15] [SPEAKER_01]: Tomorrow we're going to

[00:09:17] [SPEAKER_01]: Bannock bar and we're going to Starlin cat, you know, I mean

[00:09:20] [SPEAKER_01]: And it was brilliant. So and I've just loved it ever since

[00:09:24] [SPEAKER_01]: so

[00:09:25] [SPEAKER_01]: It's really easy to get into your guiding if you're if you have an interest

[00:09:30] [SPEAKER_01]: in

[00:09:31] [SPEAKER_01]: The things that obviously that you kind of need to know

[00:09:36] [SPEAKER_01]: Then that does help

[00:09:38] [SPEAKER_01]: But I've seen I've literally seen people coming into

[00:09:42] [SPEAKER_01]: Guide at companies and I thought

[00:09:46] [SPEAKER_01]: They don't appear to have any interest whatsoever

[00:09:49] [SPEAKER_01]: In in what's going on, but then they turn out to be some of the best like tour guides

[00:09:55] [SPEAKER_01]: I've ever worked with, you know, so so that way anyone can do it all of the information is there

[00:10:00] [SPEAKER_01]: They you know, we're in the internet generation where every piece of information in the world ever is

[00:10:07] [SPEAKER_01]: In this one place and you can find out anything within seconds, you know, so even after

[00:10:13] [SPEAKER_01]: Technically five years. I always say I've done it for seven

[00:10:16] [SPEAKER_01]: I started doing it seven years ago, but then there was there was that kind of little pandemic thing that kind of came

[00:10:23] [SPEAKER_01]: And so it's two years that I technically didn't do it

[00:10:27] [SPEAKER_01]: So so yeah, so technically over the last five years and then you were podcasting. Yeah, I tried I tried

[00:10:34] [SPEAKER_01]: I'm still trying I promise

[00:10:38] [SPEAKER_01]: But yeah, so even over five years I still get questions

[00:10:41] [SPEAKER_01]: I've never been asked before and I still need to I still need to go and learn new stuff

[00:10:45] [SPEAKER_00]: so I think it's interesting that

[00:10:48] [SPEAKER_00]: Your description of your childhood is it's all different than from mine apart from the fact that I can't get a job being the tour guide

[00:10:54] [SPEAKER_00]: For doing these things but like my my dad did the exact same thing

[00:10:57] [SPEAKER_00]: He'd be like we're gonna go see where the Battle of the Thames took place

[00:11:00] [SPEAKER_00]: You know, I mean there's not a lot of battles that happened in southern Ontario

[00:11:04] [SPEAKER_00]: But we're gonna go there and now we're gonna go to this Fort in Leamington

[00:11:09] [SPEAKER_00]: And nor you know like that that sort of thing and it was this is what the history of this area is

[00:11:13] [SPEAKER_00]: But it's not feel like you know, it's like 200 years

[00:11:18] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I mean, I think I think no one history is always history regardless of how old it is

[00:11:25] [SPEAKER_01]: like you know the

[00:11:29] [SPEAKER_01]: I think the thing the best thing that I find about more recent history

[00:11:33] [SPEAKER_01]: Is the fact that a lot of places will remain preserved and quite well preserved

[00:11:40] [SPEAKER_01]: Like you know in the last time I was on I was obviously I think I was talking about Orkney and

[00:11:45] [SPEAKER_01]: Places up on Orkney, you know, you still got like they still have like the big gun in placements

[00:11:50] [SPEAKER_01]: Like for World War two

[00:11:52] [SPEAKER_01]: They still have the block ships from World War one because you know because it's so recent that they

[00:11:58] [SPEAKER_01]: Just never kind of took them away and now they won't take them away because it's part of the attraction

[00:12:03] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah

[00:12:03] [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, the value of history I think is different now than it was when if you're Robert the Bruce

[00:12:11] [SPEAKER_00]: No one's thinking like well what we should do is we should probably set aside the sword that he used it

[00:12:16] [SPEAKER_00]: At this battle because we're gonna want to put it in a glass case at some point so that we can

[00:12:22] [SPEAKER_01]: The battle gather up everything put it into a box

[00:12:25] [SPEAKER_01]: We're gonna lock it in a box and keep it in a storeroom for 700 years until someone goes

[00:12:29] [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, this might have been important. Yes, exactly. The problem is as we went through the Victorian era

[00:12:36] [SPEAKER_01]: Yes here the Victorians they just they just knocked everything down

[00:12:40] [SPEAKER_01]: They were like we're building a train station. Oh, there's a there's an ancient fort there. We don't care knock it down

[00:12:47] [SPEAKER_01]: doesn't matter

[00:12:49] [SPEAKER_01]: Doesn't matter at all

[00:12:50] [SPEAKER_01]: Standing stone circled who cares road right the way through the middle of it, you know

[00:12:55] [SPEAKER_00]: So so what what does it like to be a tour guide?

[00:12:58] [SPEAKER_00]: Like what's a day in the life like do you do you get up super early and got a got to get going?

[00:13:03] [SPEAKER_00]: Is it a multi-day thing usually or or is it you doing like day trips out? I do mixture

[00:13:10] [SPEAKER_01]: So every day is different like literally every day is different

[00:13:13] [SPEAKER_01]: I can't remember the last time when I maybe did the same two or two days in a row. Maybe done at the same

[00:13:20] [SPEAKER_01]: Like in the same five days. So so usually just work five days over the course of seven

[00:13:27] [SPEAKER_01]: So it's not quite a Monday or Friday thing

[00:13:30] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, most of most of like the the tours I do if it's a day trip

[00:13:36] [SPEAKER_01]: It's it's kind of an all-day type thing. You know, it's like 12 hours 10

[00:13:41] [SPEAKER_01]: 10 12 hours 13. I think is the longest day that we do

[00:13:46] [SPEAKER_01]: So I'm usually but the benefit is is I

[00:13:51] [SPEAKER_01]: Just get up at the same time every single day

[00:13:53] [SPEAKER_01]: so I don't

[00:13:55] [SPEAKER_01]: See came my doesn't start. I don't need to be at the yard until nine o'clock

[00:14:00] [SPEAKER_01]: So I'm gonna leave it eight o'clock in the morning. No, I just leave it six or six thirty because

[00:14:06] [SPEAKER_01]: It's just it's just so much easier

[00:14:09] [SPEAKER_01]: To be at work nice and I prefer to be early than be late

[00:14:13] [SPEAKER_01]: so I get there and then

[00:14:17] [SPEAKER_01]: Obviously it's in to get the bus ready and go off and do the tour

[00:14:21] [SPEAKER_01]: So all the tours depart at different times

[00:14:23] [SPEAKER_01]: mostly come back around about the same time around about kind of

[00:14:27] [SPEAKER_01]: 637 p.m

[00:14:31] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, yeah round about kind of dinner time

[00:14:33] [SPEAKER_01]: So usually the tour will cover lunch time. So you'll have there'll be a stop somewhere where you'll have lunch

[00:14:39] [SPEAKER_01]: But then we'll be back sort of early evening or you know kind of mid to late evening for

[00:14:47] [SPEAKER_01]: For a certain dinner time

[00:14:50] [SPEAKER_01]: But mostly I tend to do the multi days

[00:14:54] [SPEAKER_01]: So I tend to be away for anything between just one night to two nights three nights four nights

[00:15:02] [SPEAKER_01]: So

[00:15:03] [SPEAKER_01]: So those are those are obviously much better

[00:15:06] [SPEAKER_01]: I do I do kind of prefer the the multi day trips

[00:15:09] [SPEAKER_01]: Because you get to know people on the tour, you know, I think you know day trip

[00:15:13] [SPEAKER_01]: You know anything I realistically only have like five or six hours

[00:15:17] [SPEAKER_01]: You know with these with these people so it's a lot harder to kind of get to know people

[00:15:24] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, and because you're trying to fit everything into a day

[00:15:27] [SPEAKER_01]: My mind is always just set on doing the things and giving good enough time to see things. Yeah

[00:15:34] [SPEAKER_01]: Whereas when the multi days, it's like, okay

[00:15:36] [SPEAKER_01]: We maybe say five minutes late in the part in the bus station or 10 minutes late doing this

[00:15:41] [SPEAKER_01]: It's like it's okay because I can I can just adjust things around

[00:15:45] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I'll just basically say listen will maybe be

[00:15:50] [SPEAKER_01]: 20 minutes late finishing this evening

[00:15:53] [SPEAKER_01]: So instead of finishing at six o'clock or five o'clock like I said we might finish it 20 past or half past or something

[00:15:59] [SPEAKER_01]: Usually, you know, you're on holiday. So no one's really that bothered about that

[00:16:04] [SPEAKER_01]: Just as long as obviously it's not too late then because you still have to get people in to go out and get something to eat

[00:16:11] [SPEAKER_01]: so

[00:16:13] [SPEAKER_01]: So yeah, no multi-day usually

[00:16:16] [SPEAKER_01]: Starts about I think say about half past eight you leave Edinburgh

[00:16:21] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, and then end of the day will be about 5 36 o'clock that type thing. So

[00:16:28] [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I do much prefer the longer tours. How far out can you get on a single day trip?

[00:16:35] [SPEAKER_01]: The longest

[00:16:37] [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah

[00:16:38] [SPEAKER_00]: Loch Ness. I'm just kind of curious

[00:16:40] [SPEAKER_00]: Loch Ness from Edinburgh. That's pretty far. That's a pretty good distance. Yeah, so I think

[00:16:46] [SPEAKER_01]: I

[00:16:48] [SPEAKER_01]: Think it's somewhere around about

[00:16:52] [SPEAKER_01]: 300 and

[00:16:54] [SPEAKER_01]: I'll just I'll just say about 350 miles

[00:16:57] [SPEAKER_01]: 550 kilometers something like that in one day. Yeah

[00:17:01] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, that's a bit so it's it's billed as

[00:17:05] [SPEAKER_01]: 745 a.m. Until 745 p.m. So that's like 12 hours

[00:17:10] [SPEAKER_01]: About eight hours of that is driving

[00:17:14] [SPEAKER_01]: So, you know, you don't get much time. Yeah

[00:17:17] [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, easily because they're about eight hours of it. There's no

[00:17:21] [SPEAKER_00]: Big main highway that goes straight there, correct? Like there's no, you know six lane

[00:17:26] [SPEAKER_01]: You get you get like the beginning of the tour is on the motorway and the end of the tour

[00:17:31] [SPEAKER_01]: It's on the motorway all the bits in between so like the majority of it is

[00:17:36] [SPEAKER_01]: No, it's the small narrow windy roads

[00:17:41] [SPEAKER_01]: Not as windy. I don't find them as windy now as I used to find them

[00:17:46] [SPEAKER_01]: But I've driven them a thousand times now probably

[00:17:51] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, so there you know, you know every bend every bump in the road

[00:17:57] [SPEAKER_01]: So, you know, you can adjust speed is like, oh, okay. This this kind of goes like woo

[00:18:03] [SPEAKER_01]: And I've done this. Yeah, some people don't like that. So I'll I'll ease off a little bit go nice and slow

[00:18:10] [SPEAKER_01]: And and what have you know, you know

[00:18:12] [SPEAKER_01]: You even start to know where all the puddles are like when it rains and it like rains for days and days

[00:18:17] [SPEAKER_01]: So you actually know where all the flooding is gonna be before you even gone through it's it's I

[00:18:23] [SPEAKER_00]: Didn't I hadn't thought of it in terms of like how comfortable with the route you could you could be like that?

[00:18:29] [SPEAKER_00]: I think I was gonna ask a question about your comfort with those with those bends knowing that you have much people in there

[00:18:35] [SPEAKER_00]: You're driving a giant you're trying bus and everything like that

[00:18:38] [SPEAKER_00]: But just like the the sheer volume of your trips

[00:18:42] [SPEAKER_00]: You know, you like you said knowing the bends knowing where the puddles are knowing knowing these are roots

[00:18:47] [SPEAKER_00]: I

[00:18:48] [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, it makes more sense to me that you could feel comfortable because I remember going I haven't driven around

[00:18:54] [SPEAKER_00]: In the Highlands in Scotland. I remember driving around in Ireland though

[00:18:58] [SPEAKER_00]: On roads that I was you know, I mean from a from a North American perspective these roads are like

[00:19:05] [SPEAKER_00]: Nonsensically skinny. Yeah, I'm driving

[00:19:07] [SPEAKER_01]: Like the dirt track

[00:19:10] [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, but but I'm driving a little subcompact tiny little like Nissan micro or something like that and a giant bus is coming

[00:19:19] [SPEAKER_01]: That's the car I learned to drive in

[00:19:21] [SPEAKER_00]: It's like how how can I I barely fit

[00:19:25] [SPEAKER_00]: I at least it feels like I barely fit in the lane that I'm in and there's a bus going by the other direction

[00:19:30] [SPEAKER_00]: I just I cannot believe someone's driving that bus

[00:19:34] [SPEAKER_00]: confidently. Yeah, but it sounds like they are

[00:19:37] [SPEAKER_01]: well, yeah, I mean to become a bus driver obviously you have to have had

[00:19:42] [SPEAKER_01]: Your driver's license for X amount of time of things a minimum of two years

[00:19:47] [SPEAKER_01]: So I think we can we get I think you can learn to drive when you're 17

[00:19:52] [SPEAKER_01]: So technically you could pass when you're 17

[00:19:55] [SPEAKER_01]: So you could technically be driving a truck like a like a big a big sort of hgv truck or even a

[00:20:02] [SPEAKER_01]: Full-size coach by the time that you were in 1920

[00:20:06] [SPEAKER_01]: um, yeah, and the training certainly when I got it for as I say driving these like big double-decker buses

[00:20:15] [SPEAKER_01]: Um, yeah, I think I think it was eight weeks

[00:20:19] [SPEAKER_01]: So you had eight weeks really kind of get yourself comfortable and because I learned how to drive in the city

[00:20:25] [SPEAKER_01]: Things are a lot kind of you know, you've got parked cars on the road

[00:20:28] [SPEAKER_01]: You literally just have people walking out in front of you constantly

[00:20:31] [SPEAKER_01]: So I think I think that helps you learn when you get up into the highlands

[00:20:35] [SPEAKER_01]: I can always tell when there's a coach driver that's never driven those roads before

[00:20:41] [SPEAKER_01]: Because those roads believe it or not the speed limit on them is 60 miles an hour

[00:20:47] [SPEAKER_01]: For a coach that are 50, you know 50 miles an hour because

[00:20:51] [SPEAKER_01]: Depends on the size of the vehicle depends on what your maximum speed that you're allowed to do

[00:20:55] [SPEAKER_01]: so

[00:20:57] [SPEAKER_01]: And and these things are crawling around at 25 30 miles an hour. You're like, oh my god. This is like already like, you know

[00:21:04] [SPEAKER_01]: Ah, this is that's that's immediately half an hour that we have lost just stuck behind this

[00:21:10] [SPEAKER_01]: Um, they always pull over though. They will always pull over when there's a line of traffic behind them, which is which is great

[00:21:17] [SPEAKER_01]: um

[00:21:18] [SPEAKER_01]: But yeah, I remember the um because I think one of your questions was like, what was it like the first time

[00:21:24] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah that I went up. Um, so

[00:21:27] [SPEAKER_01]: The coach companies and and they the the tour companies I've worked for because I've worked for

[00:21:33] [SPEAKER_01]: four I think now

[00:21:35] [SPEAKER_01]: So now I just do mini vans

[00:21:38] [SPEAKER_01]: Okay, so 16 16 seaters

[00:21:40] [SPEAKER_01]: If you're familiar with the Mercedes sprinter

[00:21:45] [SPEAKER_01]: Yep, it's a long wheel based

[00:21:47] [SPEAKER_01]: Mercedes sprinter van. So we only carry 16 passengers maximum. That's all we do

[00:21:51] [SPEAKER_01]: Whereas previously I have done 53

[00:21:54] [SPEAKER_01]: See or big monsters and the big ones

[00:21:57] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, and then yeah, and then some of the companies do what are called midi coaches

[00:22:01] [SPEAKER_01]: So they're like halfway between 16 and 50

[00:22:05] [SPEAKER_01]: So they're about 30 seers

[00:22:07] [SPEAKER_01]: The 30 seers they're fine

[00:22:09] [SPEAKER_01]: Um, because they're basically just the same as the 16 seers just a little bit longer

[00:22:15] [SPEAKER_01]: The other ones are obviously super long

[00:22:18] [SPEAKER_01]: So I remember the first time driving a like driving a large coach up there, but because I had

[00:22:24] [SPEAKER_01]: Driven there many times in a small midi coach

[00:22:27] [SPEAKER_01]: It was just being a little bit more aware and I think

[00:22:30] [SPEAKER_01]: um

[00:22:32] [SPEAKER_01]: When when it comes to driving professionally so driving coaches and trucks and stuff like that

[00:22:38] [SPEAKER_01]: Um, we need to have a separate license

[00:22:42] [SPEAKER_01]: Um, yeah to carry passengers and to show that you can actually drive this bus

[00:22:46] [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, obviously you pass the bus test

[00:22:48] [SPEAKER_01]: But then there's other little tests that you need to pass in between

[00:22:51] [SPEAKER_01]: So it's things like awareness

[00:22:53] [SPEAKER_01]: And if anything was to go wrong, then you'll automatically get the blame for it

[00:22:59] [SPEAKER_01]: As a big

[00:23:00] [SPEAKER_01]: Vehicle driver, it's automatically your fault until you can prove otherwise type thing

[00:23:05] [SPEAKER_01]: and so

[00:23:07] [SPEAKER_01]: Um, I find it nowadays as they just being in the nice small vans

[00:23:12] [SPEAKER_01]: So much easier

[00:23:15] [SPEAKER_01]: It's a much it's a much better. I miss driving big buses, but I don't miss

[00:23:19] [SPEAKER_01]: Having to deal with so many people

[00:23:22] [SPEAKER_01]: 16 is a good round number because then I can remember every face

[00:23:27] [SPEAKER_01]: Um, yeah, I can get a feel for who they are at the time time. Yeah, and where they're from

[00:23:32] [SPEAKER_01]: I say I can almost remember people's names

[00:23:36] [SPEAKER_00]: Which ones are very very keen to be talking? Which ones want to be kind of left alone?

[00:23:44] [SPEAKER_00]: Absolutely you get you get both types as well

[00:23:48] [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, what are your favorite place to visit like places to visit as a tour guide? Um

[00:23:54] [SPEAKER_01]: Do you know I think I think I can't just continue seeing orc me

[00:23:59] [SPEAKER_01]: Because I mean that's that's pretty much the answer that I give every single time

[00:24:03] [SPEAKER_01]: Um

[00:24:05] [SPEAKER_01]: So

[00:24:06] [SPEAKER_01]: Um, do you know

[00:24:07] [SPEAKER_01]: Since it's it could be multiple places like it doesn't have to be one. Well, yeah

[00:24:12] [SPEAKER_01]: well, I think certainly one of my kind of favorite tours

[00:24:16] [SPEAKER_01]: Um that I do is and and bizarrely

[00:24:21] [SPEAKER_01]: Is actually the outlander tour

[00:24:24] [SPEAKER_01]: Um, which and I never ever thought in my life that I would ever say that

[00:24:28] [SPEAKER_01]: Um, because like we didn't get outlander until

[00:24:33] [SPEAKER_01]: I think 2017 so I think they started showing it in 2014 and it didn't add no, sorry

[00:24:39] [SPEAKER_01]: I think I think the first episode was in 2014, but we didn't get until like 2018 or 2019

[00:24:45] [SPEAKER_01]: um

[00:24:46] [SPEAKER_01]: Like on terrestrial tv you could watch it if um if you maybe had it illegal means of being able to see it

[00:24:55] [SPEAKER_01]: Uh, yes illegal downloads and stuff. Um, so I never I never really started watching it until

[00:25:03] [SPEAKER_01]: Maybe the winter of 2022

[00:25:09] [SPEAKER_01]: Um

[00:25:10] [SPEAKER_01]: Because I'd managed to avoid doing outlander tours up until that point

[00:25:14] [SPEAKER_01]: Um, so I started watching it and I was like, yeah, this is this is pretty good

[00:25:17] [SPEAKER_01]: I mean certainly the history of it is is excellent

[00:25:19] [SPEAKER_01]: But the tour that we do are all of the places that my dad used to take me to when I was young

[00:25:26] [SPEAKER_01]: So like so with ravi's tour we go to blackness castle the ship that never sailed as it's known

[00:25:32] [SPEAKER_01]: Uh, which is an amazing castle and you know, and I've got so many personal stories there

[00:25:36] [SPEAKER_01]: Like the first time I ever fell over into a um into a bush of um stinging nettles

[00:25:43] [SPEAKER_01]: Um, I remember because that was that was a blackness castle

[00:25:47] [SPEAKER_01]: So I always tell people about that linlethgow palace

[00:25:49] [SPEAKER_01]: We always used to go there and go to linlethgow lock and feed the ducks

[00:25:54] [SPEAKER_01]: And then we would go for dinner at one of um, sort of families favorite restaurants in linlethgow as well

[00:26:01] [SPEAKER_01]: uh, dun castle because monty python in the holy grail

[00:26:05] [SPEAKER_01]: Um for me, but it's also an outlander too

[00:26:08] [SPEAKER_01]: um and

[00:26:09] [SPEAKER_01]: Curus as well. So there's a tiny little

[00:26:13] [SPEAKER_01]: village called curis

[00:26:15] [SPEAKER_01]: Right on the furth of fourth just the other side of the

[00:26:18] [SPEAKER_01]: Just the other side of the furth of fourth

[00:26:22] [SPEAKER_01]: From you can actually see blackness castle like over the other side of the water from there

[00:26:26] [SPEAKER_01]: Um, so I I find that and because i'm from that area

[00:26:31] [SPEAKER_01]: I'm from kind of the west loathian area and blackness castle in lithgow are consider west loathian

[00:26:37] [SPEAKER_01]: Um, that I kind of like being there because it's different

[00:26:41] [SPEAKER_01]: You know, I'm not seeing Loch Ness for the 90th time in a month. I'm not seeing

[00:26:46] [SPEAKER_01]: You know, Glencoe which don't get me wrong. Glencoe is absolutely stunning. It's absolutely beautiful

[00:26:52] [SPEAKER_01]: Um, but I think you know, it's nice for that that that little change

[00:26:57] [SPEAKER_01]: And I also really love roslin roslin chapel

[00:27:01] [SPEAKER_01]: Uh melrose

[00:27:04] [SPEAKER_01]: Um, so there's a two that we do that does roslin chapel melrose

[00:27:08] [SPEAKER_01]: Um

[00:27:09] [SPEAKER_01]: Oh scots view which I'd never seen before so again that that was blowing my mind

[00:27:15] [SPEAKER_01]: Um, and there's a there's a william wallis statue not far from me

[00:27:18] [SPEAKER_00]: I would imagine that the outlander

[00:27:21] [SPEAKER_00]: um tour

[00:27:24] [SPEAKER_00]: Participants are really engaged too

[00:27:26] [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, absolutely. Absolutely to the point where they are the hardest

[00:27:32] [SPEAKER_01]: I think I think it's it's one of the best tours, but it is also one of the hardest tours to do

[00:27:38] [SPEAKER_01]: because you've got

[00:27:40] [SPEAKER_01]: Especially on the day trip because we also do a four-day outlander tour

[00:27:44] [SPEAKER_01]: Um, so it spins, you know, so you actually go to collodon and stuff rather than just the the local filming sites

[00:27:50] [SPEAKER_01]: of the show

[00:27:54] [SPEAKER_01]: So the reason why I find it the hardest is because you've seen you've had people who've always wanted to see these sites

[00:27:59] [SPEAKER_01]: Yes, they know everything about outlander

[00:28:03] [SPEAKER_01]: and then

[00:28:04] [SPEAKER_01]: You know, I rock up

[00:28:06] [SPEAKER_01]: With my kill on because you can't do an outlander tour without a kill on, you know

[00:28:10] [SPEAKER_01]: So I turn up with a kill on i've got the music playing, you know

[00:28:13] [SPEAKER_01]: I've got the the music by bear mccree playing in the background as they're boarding onto the bus getting them into

[00:28:19] [SPEAKER_01]: and then, you know and trying as hard as I can

[00:28:24] [SPEAKER_01]: to remember

[00:28:25] [SPEAKER_01]: All of the things from the show

[00:28:28] [SPEAKER_01]: And I'll even say like there'll be there'll be some names that I will that I'll forget but I can I can tell you

[00:28:33] [SPEAKER_01]: You know each of where this location features in in each

[00:28:39] [SPEAKER_01]: season but

[00:28:41] [SPEAKER_01]: You know it is it is kind of quite hard

[00:28:44] [SPEAKER_01]: To get it completely right every single time. Uh, you know, it's it's hard to get it right every single time

[00:28:50] [SPEAKER_01]: But that's because I mean I would be very focused on details

[00:28:54] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, absolutely like I would be the same if I went on a montie python in the holy grail tour and the

[00:28:59] [SPEAKER_01]: You know the guide clearly didn't know

[00:29:02] [SPEAKER_01]: About certain things

[00:29:04] [SPEAKER_01]: Which is fine

[00:29:05] [SPEAKER_01]: But I think what I try and do is get the group to help me because I want to know these

[00:29:11] [SPEAKER_01]: To make the tour better. So if they were to come on the tour again

[00:29:15] [SPEAKER_01]: And it was me again

[00:29:17] [SPEAKER_01]: That I would be able to relay the the things that they want to know

[00:29:20] [SPEAKER_01]: So I try and find out the things that the groups want to know as well

[00:29:24] [SPEAKER_01]: Um because outlander's huge and and it's multinational as well

[00:29:28] [SPEAKER_01]: It's not just like the us. It's not just canada. It's not just

[00:29:32] [SPEAKER_01]: You know australian and and like the sort of more english-speaking countries have had people from spain

[00:29:38] [SPEAKER_01]: Italy

[00:29:39] [SPEAKER_01]: and turkey

[00:29:41] [SPEAKER_01]: Nigeria as well on on those sorts of tours so

[00:29:45] [SPEAKER_01]: um again, I try to

[00:29:47] [SPEAKER_01]: Certainly myself personally and I think as I was a lot of my colleagues

[00:29:51] [SPEAKER_01]: Um

[00:29:53] [SPEAKER_01]: Because I tried to avoid them

[00:29:54] [SPEAKER_01]: I tried to avoid the outlander tours for a long time and then realized no I need to do this

[00:30:00] [SPEAKER_01]: But it was because I felt as though I couldn't give a good tour

[00:30:04] [SPEAKER_01]: You know, I just felt as though I would not be able to give them a good tour by not knowing about it

[00:30:10] [SPEAKER_01]: Um, I could tell the real story. You know, I could tell the the story of

[00:30:15] [SPEAKER_01]: Calodon not a problem and and and the whole history as to why the jackbikes existed in the first place

[00:30:21] [SPEAKER_01]: But is that what they're looking for? No, they're looking for more

[00:30:25] [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah under so yeah

[00:30:26] [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah

[00:30:28] [SPEAKER_00]: What that's the this the sign of a true professional right there didn't want to do the job unless you can do it well

[00:30:34] [SPEAKER_00]: Um, we're we're running a little bit longer than uh, than anticipated. Oh, yeah, sorry. I feel like you were good right now

[00:30:40] [SPEAKER_00]: We're running a little bit behind here

[00:30:42] [SPEAKER_00]: Um, but uh, you have to cut some time off lunch

[00:30:46] [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, exactly. Just chop chop the lunch out of this one

[00:30:50] [SPEAKER_00]: just uh

[00:30:51] [SPEAKER_00]: Do you have any any good stories for us anything?

[00:30:55] [SPEAKER_00]: Funny something terrifying something like like that in just a couple of minutes

[00:30:59] [SPEAKER_00]: Like anything that kind of springs to mind of like a real experience you've had as

[00:31:04] [SPEAKER_00]: That people might find interesting, you know

[00:31:07] [SPEAKER_01]: All the weird stuff happens on sky

[00:31:09] [SPEAKER_01]: Like I've had some really really weird stuff going on in sky

[00:31:15] [SPEAKER_01]: um

[00:31:15] [SPEAKER_01]: I had uh someone I think

[00:31:18] [SPEAKER_01]: I don't I I want one of my group met a

[00:31:22] [SPEAKER_01]: Uh met someone who was playing in a band

[00:31:24] [SPEAKER_01]: You know, there was a live music night going on or something like that

[00:31:27] [SPEAKER_01]: She met up with the bass player and they got on really well

[00:31:30] [SPEAKER_01]: And then she found herself in his hotel room and I was looking for her in the morning and I couldn't find her

[00:31:36] [SPEAKER_01]: I didn't know where she was

[00:31:38] Um

[00:31:40] [SPEAKER_01]: Eventually we get a really panicked phone call saying has the bus left yet. I didn't have my phone or my charger

[00:31:46] [SPEAKER_01]: I don't have my clothes or anything. I'm just but I'm in the hotel across the other side of the water. It's like that's weird

[00:31:52] [SPEAKER_01]: Um, you know, I mean fair enough, you know, you're having a good time. You're on holiday. But uh, yeah, so this

[00:31:58] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, maybe not quite the stories you thought you were gonna get but

[00:32:02] [SPEAKER_00]: No, I don't I didn't know what kind of stories I was gonna get

[00:32:05] [SPEAKER_00]: Um for people picking a tour, uh, is there anything you'd avoid anything you'd recommend?

[00:32:11] [SPEAKER_00]: um

[00:32:11] [SPEAKER_01]: Bum bum bum bum bum. So if choosing a day tour, uh, the Loch Ness tour is good. Um

[00:32:19] [SPEAKER_01]: I again, I personally like the the rabbis tour

[00:32:22] [SPEAKER_01]: Not just because that's who I work for I wouldn't work for them

[00:32:27] [SPEAKER_01]: Um for any other reason then I know they do good tours

[00:32:30] [SPEAKER_01]: Um, but I like rabbis one because it starts a little bit earlier than all the other tour companies do and you get more time

[00:32:36] [SPEAKER_01]: See, you know, there's more time sort of in there

[00:32:39] [SPEAKER_01]: Um, and all of my colleagues are obviously fantastic. Um

[00:32:43] [SPEAKER_01]: So if choosing like a day tour, that's a good one personally, I would maybe go for the two day

[00:32:49] [SPEAKER_01]: Tour, uh, so we do a two-day Loch Ness tour

[00:32:52] [SPEAKER_01]: So you actually get to go to collauder or visit collaudon

[00:32:55] [SPEAKER_01]: Don't necessarily get to do the um visitor center there

[00:32:58] [SPEAKER_01]: But you know, so you get to see some of Highland Persia

[00:33:02] [SPEAKER_01]: bit of the Cairngorms national park

[00:33:05] [SPEAKER_01]: Collaudon stay the night in Inverness my favorite city in all of scotland

[00:33:08] [SPEAKER_01]: And then you see Loch Ness the castle um, arcart castle on Loch Ness and then of course glenco and all that type of thing

[00:33:15] [SPEAKER_01]: So I would say go for the two day over the one day

[00:33:19] [SPEAKER_01]: Um, obviously if you want to see sky

[00:33:22] [SPEAKER_01]: rabbis offers a three-day and a four-day tour

[00:33:25] [SPEAKER_01]: Um, I like the I like both probably the

[00:33:29] [SPEAKER_01]: The three day is fine if you don't have enough time but the four days

[00:33:32] [SPEAKER_01]: Is again probably the most

[00:33:34] [SPEAKER_01]: Um most recommended because you'll even see the glenfinn and viaduct from harry potter as well on that tour usually

[00:33:41] [SPEAKER_01]: Um, and then you get the boat you get the ferry so you get to sail over the sea to sky and all that type thing

[00:33:48] [SPEAKER_01]: Um, obviously i'm gonna say orkney

[00:33:51] [SPEAKER_00]: Uh as well, so I feel like you mentioned orkney last last time you were on the show too

[00:33:56] [SPEAKER_00]: Just a few times probably. Yeah just a few times. Yeah

[00:33:59] [SPEAKER_00]: Came up we were talking about william wallis, but for some reason you kept just yelling orkney

[00:34:04] [SPEAKER_00]: Exactly exactly

[00:34:06] [SPEAKER_00]: If people okay, so if if people want to do a scottish tour with the oan inis

[00:34:13] [SPEAKER_00]: Um, I guess they they go look up rabbis right and and hope for the luck of the draw

[00:34:20] [SPEAKER_00]: Luck of the draw unfortunately. Yeah

[00:34:23] [SPEAKER_01]: Um, yeah, I don't really know what i'm doing

[00:34:27] [SPEAKER_01]: Um

[00:34:28] [SPEAKER_01]: Um, well, I know I know about a month in advance

[00:34:31] [SPEAKER_01]: But for these sorts of things especially when doing a multi-day tour you want to ensure that you know, there's going to be a

[00:34:37] [SPEAKER_01]: Commodation and stuff. Yeah, so well in advance. So unfortunately it is luck of the draw

[00:34:41] [SPEAKER_01]: But uh, I say I work for a company called rabbis. They're absolutely brilliant small group tours

[00:34:47] [SPEAKER_01]: Um, and I think the website is just rabbis.com r a

[00:34:52] [SPEAKER_01]: bb i es

[00:34:53] [SPEAKER_00]: All right, I'll I'll share those links in the show notes too for anyone who's listening and interested in

[00:35:01] [SPEAKER_00]: In uh taking their their shot with maybe getting getting on oan's tour

[00:35:06] [SPEAKER_00]: Thank you so much for joining us oan for those interested

[00:35:10] [SPEAKER_00]: In hearing more of oan's voice. I will link to his podcast in the show notes as well

[00:35:21] [SPEAKER_00]: Thank you for listening to 60 for your percent scottish check us out on instagram facebook or twitter also known as x

[00:35:28] [SPEAKER_00]: You can also listen to every episode for free at 63 scottish.com

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[00:35:36] [SPEAKER_00]: It really helps a big. Thank you to friends of the podcast

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[00:35:51] [SPEAKER_00]: Until next time. Goodbye